7/14/2006

Clare Woods

67 comments:

Painter said...

Lives and works in London

dubz said...

cute, nonthreatening, endless possibilities for different compositions by pilfering the photo supply. ick ick ick.

so clever and beautiful said...

Dubz, are you one of those I-only-paint-from-life New York Academy/Desert Island type of painters? What's wrong with photos! I don't know if you are the one who is obsessed with Mark Tansey, but he even uses projected slides as a resource, not to mention endless filing cabinets. Imagery is everywhere, it can be taken from anywhere, and I sense a weird pre-nineteenth century bias against using photo references from many contributers to this blog. This is a great new piece for Painter's landscape series, very open and evocative, spoiled only by the dopey spiral branches up top.

zipthwung said...

scab,
Im the tansey booster. Tansey and HR Giger are two great artists, I'm sure you agree.
They both use source material - I think they both use photographs. I know from experience that there is more "resolution" or "detail" in a life subject than in a reproduction, even if its just some chemically induced state of awareness or some good music or something. Thats why I like Frazetta, who painted his wife from life with a butter knife.

zipthwung said...

What if everybody painted a compost heap.

This painting is a nice sly nod to Tim Buton, via superflat, I'm sure you will agree.

dubz said...

at least have the talent to fake discovery. there were a bunch of girlie YBA's who did this stuff in the late 90s... goldsmith's girls... then it caught on in LA (still going)... just feels like a means to an end and never had any emotional chops... plotted and planned and executed and pictorial and going off the edges. just like this, over and over until you have nightmares about clicking and filling your whole world with a little paint bucket.

Blog Warrior said...

I thought it was a detail shot of the Laura Owens

dubz said...

i thought it was ingrid calame attacking a particularly complex sidewalk stain, assisted by matthew ritchie while wearing an urban outfitters urban renewal trompe l'oeil printed tee.

zipthwung said...

someone can trace the web of influences for this but its not going to be me. It is more complex in composition than Elizabeth cooper (6/20/2006) for example but I dont get much more out of it. I like thi s more than Lisa Reuter, but I get more out of Benjamin Edwards.

Actually I think the web of influence is the most interesting thing to me - how did this artist arrive at this point - and Im pretty sure it had something to do with Autotrace and fill (as stated above), web (Flashh) design and so on and so forth.

this is cool vector art.

It points towards the idea that even though, or because something is easy, it has resonance.

Is it better to make an easy good painting or a hard bad painting? Does it depend on context?

I dont know if Clare thinks this was hard to make or not, it just looks easy, in a way that Marylyn Minter's do, too.

Except Minter is more "conceptual" right? Where Claire is more "air conditioning"

Is that true?

Well do you care?

dubz said...

i care.
graham parks is pretty good.

zipthwung said...

this is bullshit

you see it everywhere on the web or did, and I dont know the first person to do it, but I hope to know the last.

zipthwung said...

You could argue that these sorts of works are all of the diagramatic school - julie Mehretu

being an example.

You could include "paint by numbers"

or any of the nearly ubiquitous 3d rendered photoshop jobbers:
this is easy to do

poppy said...

those that can think for themselves will
those that can't won't and will do what ever is trendy.. cest la vie
use photos
don't use photos

cha said...

Yes! whatever gets you through the night..........

epilepticadam said...

...it is only that artist who will know if they are hindered by however they use photos... it could play out in their longevity or not.... depending of obviously many factors...

E

cha said...

Using photos is like using a better brush, new brand of paint etc......just a means to an end. You're still left with the "end" result!

epilepticadam said...

Cha,

"Using photos is like using a better brush"
I would rather say, ' using photos is like using a hammer" it is a tool, one is in control of ideally,'

E

cha said...

EA...as a tool, the camera just slots into the "materials" list! Why is there an issue around using those images? It just save time.. and time is money!

epilepticadam said...

cha,
there is more to this depending on the facility of the artist on ' how ' they use a photo...so much more you seem to be overlooking...
E

cha said...

EA...can you elaborate for me... Do you mean how much the photo is the starting point, not the end point?

poppy said...

+i think he means an artist can rely too heavily on photos when doing image based work,.. esp if new to academic type work,
work can suffer... naive perhaps without intention.

cha said...

Poppy I understand in that the photo image can be so powerful that you don't want to lose that original energy.... but just to recreate it would be so unsatisfying...

chrisjag said...

Using a photo AND using photoshop soo much (in way that hopes nobody will notice) is a problem. So much work today not only has that "stopped time" look of photography, but seem to be more about photoshop than any ideas they have. What ever happened to painting being a container for a changing mind - and heaven forbid - built up over time?

cha said...

Yes that is a problem..... but some photos are so seductive!

cha said...

I'm using photos of e.g a face that's hard to paint [with fair realism] but changing the context. So a white face becomes brown... Also mixing features of a few people...different environment, etc etc....I'm not totally comfortable with it but I see it as a step on a path.....

Cooky Blaha said...

just for the record Tansey is one of the worst, tired, moronic jansen 's art history book friendly version of a contemporary pomo painter that I can think of. Zip I keep thinking youre joking with the constant tansey references, you for real?

and Giger is cool in Heavy Metal but on a wall he lacks a whoooole lot

Cooky Blaha said...

alright Im being bitchy here but cmon with the frazetta shit...how much of a stretch from him to Norman Rockwell?
a lot of those dudes only got 1 trick in the bag..

like, I adore Herge and Winsor Mckay but I dont really think they're great artists.

no-where-man said...

paint bi numbers is more important than people go over.

epilepticadam said...

cooky,

technically, Frazetta uses formula with the application of paint/color/value; but is much more painterly than a Rockwell (and note that Rockwell's application of paint is quite different than a Holbein... I know many people cannot see the difference -let alone explain it)

you are totally whitewashing all the artists you mentioned (which says so much about artists today)...

and remember history will always re-catagorize who is greater than others and it is up to one, as an individual, to be able to discern the nuance...and develop their sensibilities...

Herge and Mckay are brilliant and reflect their era well and transcend to now, not many can stand the test of time...

E

devinlevin said...

It seems so funny to me that emotion in painting is still equated with putting alot of paint on your brush. Just because something isn't entirely goopy doesn't mean it can't have emotion. It's 2006, remember.

epilepticadam said...

devinlevin
..of course that's true, i doubt anyone would disagree with that....both approaches and everything in between can be expressive...

Cooky Blaha said...

obviously I see that there are technical differences between frazetta and rockwell, but in the end are they not both simply illustrators? I can have fun looking at frank's work, while looking at norman's makes me suicidal...but after all is said and done I still find frazetta completely unfufilling as art.

Sorry for this argument, its completely tired, but I dont really see anything wrong with someone differentiating between illustration and other art; I see nothing wrong with someone taking pride in simply being an illustrator, and getting their accolades for it. I also feel Zip's comment on the illustration argument previously to be quite intelligent, about it answering questions as opposed to asking them--I see very litlle questions asked within Frazetta's work.

On another topic I thought the Rosa Loy show interesting, with one of the paintings being quite compelling. Interesting in comparison with her husband(?) Neo Rauch..

The Veronese show at the Frick was good as well.

epilepticadam said...

i agree, entirely on the illustration note( and it is completely tired agreed). only a small handful of illustrators pose their own questions and write/ create books,objects (ben katchor,chris ware, kalman, etc).... i consider those illustrators as artists in our modern day...i'd take an original herge over many of the painters posted on this site and would dismiss a rockwell.

veronese did not pose his own questions but was commissioned. as a modern observer, i see it as image ,i see many work of fine artists as image today, as well as illustrators devoid of historical context...but if i am engaged by an artists i will take note of how they wrestle with their work ...

epilepticadam said...

...and note that i'd dismiss a rockwell for technical reasons- he actually refects a facet of american society which cannot be denied... i just cant stand his work visually which is subjective.

i have read so many grad student and professional fine artist's statements out there that pose the most stupid questions/ideas or the idea is great and they can't translate it into visuals. i know herge was a much more complex and intelligent man (or katchor, etc) than many fine artists out there who can barely form ideas ( i suppose that extends itself to society as well)..

E

Cooky Blaha said...

its a shame the final tintin was never finished as it was gonna be a caper involving conceptual art!

poppy said...

cha
what i meant earlier
was learning to draw academically from a photo, without good understanding of drawing from life etc... the tech skills(academic) you will pick up learning from life, would help big time when you move to a photo source..

that was said in circles:)

poppy said...

elipti -the fact that you read so many stupid artist statements by grads - proffesionals..
is this a refelction of the art world or do you think there are just a lot more dummy's kicking around?

cha said...

Poppy..I feel, take from wherever whatever and run with it... but move through it, to your own space. {which is constantly changing?!]
Gerhard Richter...many aspects of expression.

cha said...

Just seen BBC program saying that the U.S art centre has shifted from N.Y to L.A.......

epilepticadam said...

poppy,
i do know there are more people today who call themselves artists and many have the degree to 'prove' it sort of speak.

it is up to one 'to discern' what is valid and what is not...

my coming across statements is something that is a product of the business of art these days actually... a line used to market these people whether or not they are artists.

poppy said...

gerhard richters work was very photo conscious - it was all about being photo conscious...
photo derived work that isn't surface consious of its source is fine too- like doig, if it is an issue it is on the back burner.
there is obviously quite alot that can be done with paint that uses photography as a source and never addresses this as an issue.. because it doesn't need to be.


the thing about the dumb artist statements could end up a long discussion - but i'll say i don't think artists are any dumber.. we're just alive/around to witness.

cha said...

yes to that Poppy.

statements: so many would be better not written... the gap would say more.

epilepticadam said...

... no statements would upset gallery dealers in marketing and artists would not be able to get grants (since probably the 80s with capitalism gone wild in the artworld.)

also to pose a question vs. to solve a problem (commission) what distinguishes an artist? that does not get into the complexity of all art fields. it seems it is a purity in the artist as being as free as possible to express vs. the financial trappings and demands of the artworld and art dealers.

is being asked by one's dealer, for example, to continue with a series of images (even though the artist 'finished') any better than being commercially commissioned initially when the final product of both can be judged equally visually? either may be better than the other on a purely visual level. and if we did not know of any statement would that alter our judgment?

cha said...

hard to market with no statement, no qualification..... then you just have the product!!! to play the game well.... you must be aware of the rules!

do you look at the image before reading the statement?

painterdog said...

if you can't write a good statement, you should learn to. Now that's something they should teach in grad school or god forbid, undergrad, how to write a statement that makes some kind of sense.

I mean you can make your art but no one in the big bad art world will take you seriously, it sucks but you need to be able to write well. If you want to get granst you had better write well.

epilepticadam said...

so true cha,
a cycle one has to work with in the economy today... it was not asked of the many greats in the past...the point is that at times i think fine artists think they are in a realm of freedom ... it is these days a privilaged man's game for the most part... and as a lover of the arts i dislike coming across statements that dismiss other visual arts when they are economically 'currupted' in many different ways that make them equal in my eyes...

i never read statements when i go to shows until after i look at all the work. i read them after.
E

painterdog said...

Well so many are kind of what does this have to do with the work, so I don't read them.

Its a shame but its become this fetish in the art world, the artist statement

cha said...

statements bother me somewhat because without them you have the freedom of a personal interpretation/ adventure .... but with the artists input, that becomes harder. But obviously it's always good to get the depth the statement may reveal. I find it really hard to write one because I love ambiguity!

cha said...

....and with figurative painting.....how much do you need to explain?!

wade said...

You must have missed the artists statement at the Veronese show....

But it doesn't hurt to try and articulate what you are doing... this, I'm guessing, is where grad schools come in, force you to articulate what you are doing in a way that fits or is comprehensible by current market (academic/gallery) Not that its necessary, but as someone without schooling or an art mileiu could see where it might help.

Most artist statements are lame, but artist interviews on the other hand are great... maybe someone can start a trend of replacing the statement with an interview... i.e have an intelligent viewer elicit repsonses from the artist. Maybe then it would be more like talking about your art than bs-ing.

JpegCritic said...

For the painter, photography is now an
ontological fact.

Statements are nothing more than
brand-differentiators in a market driven
surplus economy.

Personal adventure is a fantasy sold to
you by Mastercard, who uses your number
to track your spending potential.

cha said...

wade...being forced to articulate will clarify fuzzy thinking. I can see the validity there. Interviews....nice idea...much easier.

Jpg...like the statements comment!
Personal adventure.... I like the interpretations people come up with when they see work at a show...so very different from each other.
Mastercard....hmmmm! ..must book my trip!

epilepticadam said...

writing use to be a common skill, historically,one comes across many artists who wrote their ideas. artists at the undergrad level can barely write a formal letter nor gather their thoughts on paper.

this is something one should learn in high school not grad school.

kalm james said...

Artist’s statement? Gallery press release? Curator’s notes? Tisk tisk tisk (tongue clicking on roof of mouth sound) For anyone familiar with these practices you’ve got to know that they’ll basically crap. Just string together a dozen of the current fifty buzz-words that you’ll find listed in every issue of Artforum and you’re there. Half the reason people want some kind of statement is to judge whether they’ll be able to invite you to a dinner party and have you carry on an intelligent conversation with the hoy paloi. I’ve written way too many of these, for my self and others and excuse the cynicism, but it’s ad copy, a sales pitch. There’s nothing more pathetic than a weepy, sincere, simpleminded plea for understanding from the “masses.” What ever happened to the idea that a successful art work could communicate for itself? Some of my biggest disappointments were finding out that I’d “misinterpreted” an art work, and my grandiose assumptions were denigrated into some politically correct half-baked grad school drivel.

Frank Auerback, (in an artist’s statement no doubt) has said that the reason he always works from “life” instead of from photos is because he can’t see behind a photo. I thought this was funny till I was sketching from a model and found myself constantly shifting my head to check the contour from a slightly different angle. Conceptually cameras don’t have minds, so you’re editing out all those interesting things that an individual might bring to the work. Sometimes you want to use the “unthinking eye” but, as has been stated above, it’s just a tool.

poppy said...

artist statements seem like drivel to me too.. yes if you want free money, grants, figure out how to write some bs..it works

artists need to reclaim the title of artist genious....
Somebody(an artist) should take up the task of inventing a machine that will make artists and general population physically smarter.. this will get us back the title that is rightfully ours and we won't have to write artist statements for 10 or more years.
I actually have somebody working on this assignment for me right now but feel free to get behind the wheel too.

painterdog said...

There is nothing wrong with learning to write. I agree with epilepticadam people should learn this in high school.

Funny I was reading an article today in the NY times about a diary that was found from the 1930's writen by a girl who was 14 when she started it.

What struck me and the journalist(Lily Koppel)who wrote the piece is how well she wrote. About art, sex, love, and music.

By the way she went to Hunter and then to Columbia for grad school, and is still alive, is 90 years old.

We just don't vaule writing any more, look at all the negitive feedback to the artist statement. I'm not advocating it, but we all should have enough of a command of language to be able write on of these in our sleep.

no-where-man said...

manifestos are key, "Artist Statements" are a creation of achedima and total bullshit...

what do you think it means that painternyc is posting Artists from out side of NYC and the Whitney Bi is also,

painterdog said...

don't know, oh those wordy brits, they command the english language as if they invented it...

zipthwung said...

"alright Im being bitchy here but cmon with the frazetta shit...how much of a stretch from him to Norman Rockwell?"

Well I'm just wondering when Frazetta is going to get his museum show like rockwell...or at least one alongside Boris Valejo and HR Giger...

perhaps as a mirror to their respective classical influences. I think it would be interesting.

Or maybe opposite real world tribal artifacts and images.

zipthwung said...

"alright Im being bitchy here but cmon with the frazetta shit...how much of a stretch from him to Norman Rockwell?"

Well I'm just wondering when Frazetta is going to get his museum show like rockwell...or at least one alongside Boris Valejo and HR Giger...

perhaps as a mirror to their respective classical influences. I think it would be interesting.

Or maybe opposite real world tribal artifacts and images.

kalm james said...

Popster, we don’t need no stinkin machine. All we need is some good stinkin paintin. One of the French Deconstructive philosophers has dubbed this period the “Post Manifesto Era.” Norman Rockwell is great. Visit his museum in Stockbridge Mass, and I grantee you’ll be impressed with not only his work but the creative process that he went through to get to his “Post” covers. P-dog where did Rockwell and Frazetta get their degrees? How about R. Crumb, or that Rodriguez cat that paints "Blue Dog"?

no-where-man said...

“The Monkey as Painter” (circa 1740) by Jean-Siméon Chardin.

painterdog said...

I never said anything about those guys.
I don't like Frazetta that much, Rockwell at the end of his life wished he had been more of a painter like Picasso.

R. Crumb is great. He's one of the best american and original artist out there.

cha said...

kalm james...having the model to work from is perfect.... but not always possible. Combination of model and photo works okay ...and then to sculpt the figure you're painting [for even better understanding!]......
So it's back to the tools, money to pay models? time....

kalm james said...

n'w'man, Where'd that monkey get his degree, his grad papers, and his PHD? Looks like Yale material to me. Maybe he'll succeed in spite of his education rather than because of it.

dinosaurEgg said...

Rockwell is too complex to use for any illustration vs fine art argument a la photography. You can find much weaker and simpler illustrators to justify the difference between the two.

For me it's a question of content more than technique. If technical components matter most in the illustration vs. fine art argument, all conceptual art becomes mere illustration since it is simply the outcome of an idea. But, if it becomes a question of content than the discussion becomes more difficult and challenging.

Just look at his work. Don't you get a sense of the times in it (which can't be said of most of the art being made in our ahistorical period). Like conceptual art today, you have to have some information to get the meanings and they are not all cheerful and bland.

Many art historians have given him a false place, especially today. They identity him with all the things they hate about America....small towns, physical labor, family life, sense of life's purpose and a rooted belief in God (all this is supposedly kitsch). Plus throw in the progressive formalist art history that almost every museum and gallery of modern and contemporary art uses to frame art today and you have Rockwell adrift, with little positive critical value.

So, if technique is what determines whether something is illustration, than most art is illustration. But if history and content matter than the use of photos becomes another tool to create meaning.

cha said...

Dino....yes with the content being so important! aspects of technique add to the content, n'est pas?

I think so much of what I see around [and what makes the sales] is made to fit in with interior decor.