tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post4445346790416546198..comments2023-10-30T06:13:31.296-04:00Comments on PaintersNYC: Neo RauchPainterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05087735650298480553noreply@blogger.comBlogger74125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-67007139317109501822007-07-11T17:57:00.000-04:002007-07-11T17:57:00.000-04:00The clue to Rauch and the other younger East Germa...The clue to Rauch and the other younger East Germans is not Surrealism but Courbet. You have them in front of you in the Metropolitan. But as a Courbet could be a source of inspiration even today, Rauch creates a balanced mystical and slick meaningless theater of everything, playing formless with chewing gum myths. Zero. In that tradition of meta speaking on meta levels he is also a typical East German, as that was essential to survive comfortable with a little personal private opposition in the socialist system of GDR. Leipzig was the most state-system-supporting art school out of the three or four( Dresden, Berlin, Halle, Chemnitz ) and this ghost of 1 step ahead and 2 back is still a bit in the heads of the Leipzig successors, I think. In contrary the Russian (Soviet) Artists developed a much more radical and risking approach and this works even today with their successors more convincing, at least for me. The irony is that one of the smartest opposer of the former GDR system was Judy Lybke (EigenArt), without whom Rauchs success today wouldn't exist, as he works with his artists, as the sculptor with his clay. I really indulge Judy his success today. (Ich gönne es ihm.)Hanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06081946944668235348noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-11712483536316609722007-07-01T23:12:00.000-04:002007-07-01T23:12:00.000-04:00lots to learn from this artistlots to learn from this artistadhunthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00431104822564243431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-51716278135310411322007-06-20T13:17:00.000-04:002007-06-20T13:17:00.000-04:00And please eschew the conservative.ThanksThe Core ...And please eschew the conservative.<BR/><BR/>Thanks<BR/><BR/>The Core Audiencezipthwunghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02761727194113640578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-3319498057925212382007-06-19T23:36:00.000-04:002007-06-19T23:36:00.000-04:00Please move on to the next feature artist. This p...Please move on to the next feature artist. This painting is as dead as a doornail.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-56736722621080393102007-06-19T22:52:00.000-04:002007-06-19T22:52:00.000-04:00Surely fiction by definition is speculative?Surely fiction by definition is speculative?CAPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09861096695503969576noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-72582716856497495632007-06-19T22:49:00.000-04:002007-06-19T22:49:00.000-04:00Most myths are set in the past.Most myths are set in the past.CAPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09861096695503969576noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-38796071809365603452007-06-19T22:29:00.000-04:002007-06-19T22:29:00.000-04:00AU contraire cb, there's a well respected literary...AU contraire cb, there's a well respected literary tradition, as I'm sure you are aware. Ah yes, literature.<BR/><BR/>Borges "El jardin de senderos que se bifurcan" is a much referenced story, and one which apparently, and ironicly, has but one interpretation. <BR/><BR/>At least to some.<BR/><BR/>And this then segues us to the way of the many possible worlds theory , the Zombie Argument (quite interesting) and a whole other can of PARA-Doxias.<BR/><BR/>and Gabriel García Márquez, who confessed, "My most important problem was destroying the lines of demarcation that separates what seems real from what seems fantastic."<BR/><BR/>to borrow from wikipedia.<BR/><BR/>Actually, sci-fi is now "speculative fiction" set in the future or an alternate past or present, I suppose....<BR/><BR/>but none of that is in the painting - lets go back to the Zombie argument.DarthFanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06622963355001261621noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-55737274247263064942007-06-19T21:57:00.000-04:002007-06-19T21:57:00.000-04:00magical realism is more pejorative than surrealist...magical realism is more pejorative than surrealist please stop tacking on these defunct terms.thanksSvenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03414815083075269480noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-32725964489162439462007-06-19T20:00:00.000-04:002007-06-19T20:00:00.000-04:00Smith also thinks Germans are very facetious (her ...Smith also thinks Germans are very <I>facetious</I> (her review of Lupertz last month) or maybe that’s passive/aggressive or just plain old deadpan. <BR/>Anyway she knows when there’s more to tone than a punch line, and she doesn’t want to be it.<BR/>Ever get the feeling you’re now the hunted rather than hunter?<BR/>Is there one and only always right interpretation for NR? Clearly not. If there were, it would hardly be art - might just be a joke. <BR/>Can we assign him a place in art history ? Only for the next 15 minutes.<BR/>Why bother? Because that next 15 minutes are quite enough.<BR/>Where do we draw the line between form and content – how the foot looks as opposed to what the foot is? There are many distinguished theories devoted to this stuff and they’re generally regarded as highbrow territory.<BR/>Artists regularly redraw that line and call it style. <BR/>When Rosenquist first showed he was called a Magritte of the Mid-West – seems absurd now, but at the time they seemed like the most convenient/appropriate labels. No one was too worried about his theory or intellectual ambition, probably because there were theorists and intellectuals to provide that at some point.CAPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09861096695503969576noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-31532585961011116862007-06-19T18:13:00.000-04:002007-06-19T18:13:00.000-04:00But Taguba also recalled thinking, “Rumsfeld is ve...But Taguba also recalled thinking, “Rumsfeld is very perceptive and has a mind like a steel trap. There’s no way he’s suffering from C.R.S.—Can’t Remember Shit. He’s trying to acquit himself, and a lot of people are lying to protect themselves.”zipthwunghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02761727194113640578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-73398131140755521962007-06-19T15:12:00.000-04:002007-06-19T15:12:00.000-04:00...painter, pleeze help us move on......painter, pleeze help us move on...Michael Crosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01935566642237128658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-43129690215913391822007-06-19T14:57:00.000-04:002007-06-19T14:57:00.000-04:00I read a definition of middlebrow as someone with ...I read a definition of middlebrow as someone with lowbrow tastes who aspires to highbrow tastes.<BR/><BR/>Like NPR listeners who really enjoy the book reviews but don't have time to read anything because The Soprano's is on.<BR/><BR/>Which is where we start talking about the cannon.<BR/><BR/>It is encouraging to see something that looks German instead of internationally sucky. Reminds me of muralsa I've seen - on is at this college bar on seventh street in the east village called "blue and gold" - it used to be darker and there were these bavarians blowing horns - easy to overlook.DarthFanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06622963355001261621noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-27996061746015830562007-06-19T14:10:00.000-04:002007-06-19T14:10:00.000-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Nonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14324284397954018873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-917813873312963902007-06-19T13:35:00.000-04:002007-06-19T13:35:00.000-04:00I don't think it's dismissive to call this surreal...I don't think it's dismissive to call this surreal or magical realist - though the words is loaded.<BR/><BR/>Its not about melting clocks or spontaneous combustion. its not about collaging time and space or depicting tesseracts. its not about failed revolution or the last suppers of eternal return.<BR/><BR/>Its about a mood, a room tone -something this painting and all others like it share.<BR/><BR/>I don't see anything that references (critiques) that allegorical mood - tone in this painting, in the object itself. There is no transcendence from the academic, the banal. In that sense it is surrealism as absorbed by the spectacle - a Baudrillardian NULL - by its abscence it points to the non existent presence. <BR/><BR/>You may try to burn this painting with the fires of intellectual insight, but it remains a big zero.DarthFanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06622963355001261621noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-15806008812773528102007-06-19T12:22:00.000-04:002007-06-19T12:22:00.000-04:00Surreallism, as it pertains to the translating of ...Surreallism, as it pertains to the translating of one's own dream imagery or particular neuroses into painted imagery, is not for long very interesting. Ever listen to someone drone on about their crazy dream last night, or worse, their acid trip stories? However, I think many contemporary painters (incl. Rauch) are employing surreallist painting strategies, constructing uncanny spaces/scapes with non-naturalistic, even absurd components, seemingly non-sensical or contradictory "punchlines." Why? My guess/hope is there's some desire to make work that is interested in something outside of the solipsistic musing of ones's own head/painting's own history and inside jokes and to point to the familiar but often disorienting/disillisioning/unnaturalstic goings-on of the contemporary socio-political sphere. Neo does a good job of harkening up a sense of history, and the regional socio-political neuroses of his homeland, but I often feel mired in the "I had the craziest dream last night," sensation when I look at these paintings. Perhaps, as suggested above, I just don't "get it" all yet. But his painting moves are intriguing and titillating enough to keep me looking. Perhaps it is that sense of unfulfillment, alluding to but teasing out of meaning(s) that ultimately pleases us painter/viewers, since many of us talk about not wanting to deliver "too easy" or quick of a punchline or be overly didactic in our own work.Desert Island Painterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05120371134162143888noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-20451649722087313872007-06-19T11:48:00.000-04:002007-06-19T11:48:00.000-04:00And using terms like surrealism is a convenient an...And using terms like surrealism is a convenient and contemptuous way to dismiss work without trying to understand it- looking at broad categories, rather than individual works. To me it shows an acceptance of received history.<BR/><BR/>What does surrealism mean? Are Bellmer and de chirico the same?wastehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16112642416691610688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-78310125837429873802007-06-19T11:43:00.000-04:002007-06-19T11:43:00.000-04:00qq and others: is it fair to say that you are unc...qq and others: is it fair to say that you are uncomfortable with figuration that asks for interpretation? Allegory?<BR/><BR/>It seems to me that academic is what academies teach. Most of the work I see in galleries in the States seems academic to me because the artists are doing variations on what they were taught in american academies matters.<BR/><BR/>For me Smith's review in the Times made clear her formalist background and her continuing (maybe unconscious) loyalty to it. I also think she doesn't like NR succeeding without her. Her argument about the work being middlebrow is laughable, given a great deal of the work she supports, and seems mostly about her concerns about her elite authority. She pretty much failed to address any of the content in the paintings.wastehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16112642416691610688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-8803938478552151142007-06-19T10:31:00.000-04:002007-06-19T10:31:00.000-04:00compare to thishttp://www.metmuseum.org/Works_of_A...compare to this<BR/><BR/>http://www.metmuseum.org/Works_of_Art/viewOne.asp?dep=2&viewmode=0&item=33%2E61<BR/><BR/>this is why americans love this work, it props up our heritage. It is not just soviet, it is American, and that makes goood financial senseMartyMarthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02521503707512818692noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-75911417037151091022007-06-19T09:34:00.000-04:002007-06-19T09:34:00.000-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Nonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14324284397954018873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-52805062408942763102007-06-19T09:16:00.000-04:002007-06-19T09:16:00.000-04:00Cliche #23je ne sais quoi = dialoguedialogue = val...Cliche #23<BR/><BR/>je ne sais quoi = dialogue<BR/><BR/>dialogue = value<BR/><BR/>value = crit<BR/><BR/>crit = cred<BR/><BR/>cred = judgement<BR/><BR/>judgement seeks to 'pin', but the longer it takes to pin, the longer it lasts. the longer it lasts the more it costs. the cycle is up when we know, the matador stabbed the bull, or vice versa, time to go home. good work might not be known for 50 years, and even then. that's the implied meaning of this splitting modern from contemporary debarcle. give NR his 50, squashed down for now. then what? everything falls into place, or is forgotten...is he memorable and how much of an audience has he addressed? i can conjure images of his work in my head in a flash and i don't even particularly like his work, though sometimes i could, bla bla bla, carry on...webthinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01326120672162293479noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-6868851494020150572007-06-19T02:26:00.000-04:002007-06-19T02:26:00.000-04:00Not to get mushy, but I don't see any fear, love o...Not to get mushy, but I don't see any fear, love or hatred in these things. Plenty of brilliant painting though, from whence comes the comment about rhapsodic complacency, I'd guess. I also like a detached grandeur but these don't have that either.<BR/><BR/>The "propaganda poster" aspect, or social realist type figures have seemed a bit like magritte apples, objects put out of context. Perhaps this is why Roberta Smith cited the landscape painting as a promising direction or why these are like surrealist paintings but with the figures, rather than random objects, the symbolic characters placed in strange settings.<BR/><BR/>In this painting the male and female figures on the right seem to possess a little more humanity or pathos(is that a bad thing?)than some of his other characters, though.<BR/><BR/>QQ mentioned Goya's Capriccios(caprichos). Those are so different from other history painting, Rauch included, because the drama, tragedy, is actually present in the figures themselves(some more than others) and a lengthy text is not needed to "read" the image.(Assuming some basic background in Western European image making, etc.) I think this is why QQ would contrast those with Rauch, the impact is there in the image and doesn't need some explanatory text to wow the post-modernly educated mind. If it aint in the painting then it aint in the painting...its in the book and go read the book.nathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02403850599896364080noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-47390373186840497582007-06-18T22:56:00.000-04:002007-06-18T22:56:00.000-04:00It’s surprising to hear so many trying to pin Surr...It’s surprising to hear so many trying to pin Surrealism on Rauch. Something is going to be pinned on him naturally, but Surrealism never seemed the most obvious candidate to me. I don’t see anything vaguely Ernst, Magritte or Dali-like about his stuff, much less Matta, Masson or Miro-like. <BR/><BR/>When I first saw Rauchs (in repro) around 2000 they struck me as a bit like early R B Kitaj – that was when Rauch was very linear and contained more signage or text – and then as they got more improvisational and painterly, I thought he was going to turn into a sort of 50s Larry Rivers – in a <I>Washington Crossing The Delaware/ The Studio</I> way. That kind of incompleteness was a big deal in the 50s. Maybe it was existential.<BR/><BR/>I wonder if some of the urging here for Rauch to cut loose more, might be sensing this direction?<BR/>But all this is just to point out other precedents in there, the richness that can easily result in mediocrity – one very slow bandwagon too many – or just the right combination.<BR/>It doesn’t surprise me so many are reluctant to be sold on the stuff – I have reservations, a bit like those of <B>webthing</B> – but I think I can see why he’s flavor of the month.CAPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09861096695503969576noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-89933948437129692182007-06-18T13:22:00.000-04:002007-06-18T13:22:00.000-04:00Doig or Patek... time will tell.Doig or Patek... time will tell.Michael Crosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01935566642237128658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-85471211534111065102007-06-18T13:08:00.000-04:002007-06-18T13:08:00.000-04:00Zip:That’s a wonderful photoshop riff you have the...Zip:<BR/>That’s a wonderful photoshop riff you have there. <BR/><BR/>QQ:<BR/>I'm still lurking around. <BR/><BR/>I understand your issue with NR’s relationship to surrealism. My interest in his work has been less about the ostensible figuration than in the larger framework of the paintings, and how they relate to time and landscape. <BR/><BR/>you said:<BR/>---Maybe I'm just not percepive enough for this new landscape that straddles the modern and the postmodern. But the large one with firemen and the hose running between one's legs, the "Father" painting with a large man holding a smaller adult man, the gold mine painted by a man who digs up dreams into art - I'm not saying it's bad, but it feels somewhat familiar.---<BR/><BR/>I agree. However, I don’t think until NR hit the scene big did the particular fracture of late 20th century GDR really, clearly have its painter. Certainly there is/was precursors, but you didn’t get it in the package that could be shipped out. And the early work really did seem different and new, and certainly different from NY painting. And now maybe its getting too familiar.<BR/><BR/>At the end of R. Smith’s NYT piece, she said: <BR/>---He concluded his second New York show in 2002 at the David Zwirner Gallery, then in SoHo, with a painting that is unlike anything else he has shown in New York. A large landscape devoid of people or architecture, “Field” depicts a plunging expanse of deep red earth, first broken into chunks and then tilled, this difference marked by four barren shrubs. The image was built of four strong colors laid on thick and without fuss. For me this painting hangs over Mr. Rauch’s career like a beacon. He still has time to heed it.---<BR/><BR/>I think she’s getting at the landscape and framework elements in his work as encapsulated in the piece she refers to. The figures remain problematic it seems for many, including myself to a degree.<BR/>I’ve always been struck by his paintings, as well as all the younger germans, that grab that flattened german landscape where things just seem to fade off in the distance. In multiple visits to germany, I’ve always been immediately struck by that feeling, and I think these paintings capitalize on it often to good effect.<BR/><BR/>Solthra said:<BR/>---There aren't many "schools" of art out there in the current stylistic chaos... I think for a lot of people it's kind of a relief to see something that could actually be characterized as a movement...?---<BR/><BR/>Indeed. You have to give them credit, that they put this thing together, as loath as NY painters are to do so.<BR/><BR/>Nat said:<BR/><BR/>--As for the market, at the recent L.A. auction, Sotheby's or Christie's, Peter Doig reached the number 2 position for highest auction price for a living artist, behind Jasper Johns or Rauschenberg.---<BR/><BR/>Isn't the market is out of its mind? All value has been parsed from it; complete speculation reigns. Too many people with too much money chasing a limited quantity with very questionable quality. Will a Doig or Patek watch hold the value? I’d pick the watch.Thousand Points of Lighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02932681446685504110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18710060.post-88673257238352997462007-06-18T12:45:00.000-04:002007-06-18T12:45:00.000-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Nonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14324284397954018873noreply@blogger.com